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Pick-Up and Delivers

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26 Sep 2022 11:32 #335737 by Sagrilarus
My group just played Merchants of Venus and I think our plan is to record a podcast on the title. It's really a very deluxe pickup and deliver game, and with the potential for a recorded discussion I opted to look to see what other "P&Ds" are at the top of the heap in order to compare and contrast.

But I bumped into a problem. In the attempt to get a short list of such games via BGG's Advanced Search capability I got just a crazy set of titles that are marked pickup-and-deliver, when they really aren't. Their database has become so encumbered with information from likely well-intended but not terribly well-informed individuals that I can't really pull the five or eight other games that I should be considering, even though I've likely played most of them. I've played some of the titles that come up in the search results and can't for the life of me figure out how they use pickup-and-deliver in their play. Someone checked the box for an arbitrary reason at some point, and now they junk up the list.

So here's the question -- for Pickup-and-Delivers, what are the five (or so) mainstream, benchmark games that I should be considering from a discussion perspective? Let's set train games aside as I can more or less include them en-masse as a single title. What are the well-regarded, well-known games in this particular part of the tabletop gaming space?
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26 Sep 2022 12:10 - 26 Sep 2022 12:12 #335740 by dragonstout
Replied by dragonstout on topic Pick-Up and Delivers
- Roads & Boats

- Traders of Genoa

I know you said "just put all train games in one bucket", but 18xx isn't PU&D, nor are any of the cube rails games I've played (nor Ticket to Ride). I think there are just two main families of train games that are PU&D, and I think it's worth talking about them separately (partly because I honestly don't think there are that many seminal PU&D games):

- Age of Steam/Railroad Tycoon family

- Crayon Rails games


As far as I'm concerned, that's kind of it, in terms of lineages. There are plenty more, of course: Firefly, Merchants & Marauders, Xia, Outer Rim... But ALL of those feel clearly like DIRECT descendants of Merchant of Venus, but with other options in case you don't like PU&D...which is maybe exactly what you're looking to talk about.
Last edit: 26 Sep 2022 12:12 by dragonstout.
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26 Sep 2022 12:30 #335741 by Legomancer
Replied by Legomancer on topic Pick-Up and Delivers
I don't consider (Age of) Steam P&D. You don't really transport anything, you just construct a link and then it goes there. For me, P&D involves a process of moving the item, which presents issues of its own.

As said, it's hard to separate M&M, Xia, Outer Rim, and others from MoV, but those are my go-tos. It's a genre I enjoy, but I like MoV and Xia so much I don't have anything other than them. I'd rather just play them. A shorter one would be nice.
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26 Sep 2022 12:50 #335742 by Ah_Pook
Replied by Ah_Pook on topic Pick-Up and Delivers
I like Great Heartland Hauling Co a lot, for a much shorter/lighter p&d option. I've always wanted to Cinque Terre in that lighter space too but it went oop and sells for $$$ so y'know.
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26 Sep 2022 13:19 #335744 by stormseeker75
Replied by stormseeker75 on topic Pick-Up and Delivers
Star Wars Outer Rim should get a nod.
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26 Sep 2022 13:25 #335746 by Gary Sax
Replied by Gary Sax on topic Pick-Up and Delivers
Xia
Merchants and Marauders
Firefly
Merchant of Venus
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26 Sep 2022 13:58 #335748 by Space Ghost
Replied by Space Ghost on topic Pick-Up and Delivers
Return of the Heroes
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26 Sep 2022 15:53 #335751 by Legomancer
Replied by Legomancer on topic Pick-Up and Delivers
I would disrecommend Firefly. Maybe it's just me but I found nothing appealing about the "game". It felt very much like a repository of catchphrases and references. Strip them away and the P&D game you're left with can't touch most others.

But would recommend Black Fleet.
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26 Sep 2022 16:00 #335752 by Sagrilarus
Replied by Sagrilarus on topic Pick-Up and Delivers
That's the heart of the conversation, isn't it? Within the genre, which titles work, which don't, and why not? The recognizability of each is what puts them onto the table for discussion be they good or bad. But thank you for the opinion, that's the kind of thing that makes the recording work.
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26 Sep 2022 16:21 #335753 by Sagrilarus
Replied by Sagrilarus on topic Pick-Up and Delivers
Here's a prototype of the kind of discussion we hope to have on such things. If anyone wants to listen and provide feedback on content I'd appreciate it. Sound quality is a little rough on this first pass, but it's the kind of discussion we're hoping to generate.

www.dropbox.com/s/yz81hwsubkjuqe8/Primordial%20Soup.mp3?dl=0

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26 Sep 2022 19:26 - 26 Sep 2022 19:29 #335757 by mc
Replied by mc on topic Pick-Up and Delivers
Here are a few where I think the PU&D is kind of central that havent been mentioned already

Horrified (co-op)
Bus (interesting as well because i've seen it described as one of the first worker placement games as well)
Auf Ausche (classic old school german euro)
Caravan (new, but feels ooooolld in a good way)
Serenissima (I've only played the new one which is not great, but worth a shout maybe in a discussion)

(sorry, forgot the mainstream part, although arguments could be made, maybe not Caravan which is great but not a hot game).
Last edit: 26 Sep 2022 19:29 by mc.
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27 Sep 2022 04:48 - 27 Sep 2022 05:17 #335767 by Nodens
Replied by Nodens on topic Pick-Up and Delivers
Was gonna say Perry Rhodan Cosmic League, but it's too niche. It's a fine game but even in Germany almost nobody knows of its existence.

Auf Achse is a stone cold classic, as is Alaska (1979!). These were common family games in 80s Germany, because through Ravensburger distribution you got them from regular toy stores.
You should at least mention them if you want to talk about the history of the mechanism.

One could make a point for Survive, too, bc. it's so good.
Last edit: 27 Sep 2022 05:17 by Nodens.
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27 Sep 2022 09:37 #335769 by Sagrilarus
Replied by Sagrilarus on topic Pick-Up and Delivers
Ive played Auf Achse, haven't even heard of Alaska. I'll have a look, thanks for the tip!
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29 Sep 2022 15:54 #335820 by ubarose
Replied by ubarose on topic Pick-Up and Delivers
Black Fleet.

Game of the States might be worth a mention as it the first P&D that many folks play as kids. It seems like there is a beaten up copy in every school room.
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30 Sep 2022 01:22 #335828 by mc
Replied by mc on topic Pick-Up and Delivers
Oh another good recent pure one - Fast Sloths.
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